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Thread: Canoe England Waterways & Environment Charter

  1. #1
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    Default Canoe England Waterways & Environment Charter

    The current issue of Canoe Focus sets out the BCU's "policies and beliefs of how Canoe England sees the wider public use of our waterways being processed".

    I think most of us here would agree with the ideas expressed.

    It calls on the government to develop "an integrated package of measures to remove policies and practices" which prevent general access to inland waterways by canoeists.

    I have looked at it closely, but I can't see any statement of what Canoe England is going to do to bring about the changes they advocate.

    Actions speak louder than words, both for Canoe England and for individual canoeists.

    No change will occur until we stop talking and start taking action.
    Last edited by dougdew99; 12th-August-2011 at 05:54 AM.
    Doug Dew
    "The best is yet to come" My Father


  2. #2

    Default Totally agree!

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdew99 View Post
    The current issue of Canoe Focus sets out the BCU's "policies and beliefs of how Canoe England sees the wider public use of our waterways being processed".

    I think most of us here would agree with the ideas expressed.

    It calls on the government to develop "an integrated package of measures to remove policies and practices" which prevent general access to inland waterways by canoeists.

    I have looked at it closely, but I can't see any statement of what Canoe England is going to do to bring about the changes they advocate.

    Actions speak louder than words, both for Canoe England and for individual canoeists.

    No change will occur until we stop talking and start take action.
    Totally agree, and from my experience the biggest change happened when paddlers started to just paddle. In essence when we had the issue at the end of the Dee agreement.

    Actions do speak louder than words, I just wish they could get their words right to start with!

  3. #3
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    Default

    I read this too but couldn't see anywhere explaining what they were going to do with the charter. Is it their intention to send an official document to the government as a recommendation? If it's only published in the magazine what's the point?
    Bootstrap
    There's no such thing as inclement weather - you're just incorrectly dressed

  4. #4
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Bootstrap Bob View Post
    I read this too but couldn't see anywhere explaining what they were going to do with the charter. Is it their intention to send an official document to the government as a recommendation? If it's only published in the magazine what's the point?
    If they do!! I wonder if they will also get the same copy paste letter back.
    Ratty (Russ)

    I know only that what is moral is you feel good after. What is immoral is what you feel bad after.
    Ernest Hemingway

  5. #5
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    Default agree

    While OK as far as goes once again I felt underwhelmed by our national body - perhaps if they spent less energy on elite sport???? The contrast with the RYA whcih seems to manage to promote both elite sport (we do rather well in sailing!) while still being an effective campagning organisation that caters to the interests of the bulk of members is pertinent.
    sorry grumble over
    SD

  6. #6

    Default

    Nothing on the CE website!

    I suppose I'll have to read it tonight but I'm not holding my breath.

  7. #7

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    Having read the document I am very disappointed and can only think that if that is the best that they can come up with then there is not much hope. Is it just me but it seems that it reads like it was written by someone with a poor grasp of the English language. The whole thing is badly drafted with grammatical errrors, poor use of definitions for terms and at the heart of it a divided approach to the way they want to move forward. Rather than try to campaign for both an acknowledgement of historic navigation rights and pushing for a statutory general right perhaps they should decide to go one way or another. They really do need to spend some time with some of the other outdoor access campaignin groups such as The Ramblers, British Mountaineering Council and Open Spaces Society who really know how to campaign.

  8. #8
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    Default

    Is it just me but it seems that it reads like it was written by someone with a poor grasp of the English language.
    I agree. It was very amateur in the way it was written and I feel makes them look a bit stupid.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seadog View Post
    While OK as far as goes once again I felt underwhelmed by our national body - perhaps if they spent less energy on elite sport???? The contrast with the RYA whcih seems to manage to promote both elite sport (we do rather well in sailing!) while still being an effective campagning organisation that caters to the interests of the bulk of members is pertinent.
    sorry grumble over
    SD
    If we want to see why the RYA is able to be an effective campaigning organisation just look at the Board Members... HRH Duke of Edinburgh, Princess Ann, MBEs and OBEs abound. These folks have clout, you don't get a lot higher than the Queens hubby. But we can do it, as they say the meek shall inherit the earth..(Though I'll be happy with just the rivers )
    Paul.
    Just goin with the flow

  10. #10

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Bootstrap Bob View Post
    I read this too but couldn't see anywhere explaining what they were going to do with the charter. Is it their intention to send an official document to the government as a recommendation? If it's only published in the magazine what's the point?
    Perhaps the point is to make it look like they're doing something, even if they're not?
    Paul.

    Canoeing is a series of brews seperated by stretches of water...

  11. #11
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    The Charter has been formally printed (as was mentioned in Canoe Focus) and has been sent out to all MPs and many members of the House of Lords..I believe that it will also be available on the e shop free of charge for members to also send out to interested parties...

  12. #12

    Default

    My big problem with the document is its sowing of seeds of doubt about the research conducted by Doug Caffyn. The BCU/CE needs to have some balls and stand up for the merits of the research like so many recreational paddlers out there. If you start with a report which says you have existing rights, it makes a nonsense to then challenge the government to do a similar investigation and then ask it to put some laws in place which will almost inevitably lead to a dilution or even removal of those rights. The document should have said 'we have done the research', 'we believe we have rights', 'we will advise our membership accordingly and defend them if challenged'. Surely if you have an honest belief in a carefully researched investigation as to the state of the law, a court is unlikely to find against you, even if they subsequently tell you you are misleading yourself.

  13. #13
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    Until Doug's work is tested in court it will only ever be an opinion ... however strong it is .... and what I believe we are after is certainty that we can paddle on waterways and at the moment this can be done by legislation ... If Doug's work is correct (and I beleive it is) then supplimentary primary legislation would be able to enshrine is in law.

  14. #14

    Default

    There you go again. Either it's the law or it isn't. It doesn't need to be tested in court to be the law. If it is the law, it doesn't need primary legislation to make it so. I hereby guarantee that if the governement decide to enshrine the rights in law, they will be severely more limited than the current understanding expoused by Doug Caffyn. There will almost definitely be a long string of restrictions and the welsh Assembly have already given us examples of the sort of thing they might consider, and that's before the H&S police have got their hands on it.

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