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Thread: Missing canoeists found on island

  1. #1
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    Default Missing canoeists found on island

    Right then, who was it?

    Missing canoeists found on island

    The couple were spotted on Loch Awe after 12 hours

    Two canoeists whose disappearance sparked a major search of a loch have been found camping on an island.
    The pair, aged in their 30s, had not been seen for more than 12 hours when they were spotted at about 0215 GMT, on Loch Awe, near Oban, Argyll and Bute.
    Rescuers said the man and the woman, from Leeds, had set up camp on Innis Chonnell island for the night but had not told anyone.
    A rescue helicopter, two boats and five other vehicles were used in the search.
    The owners of a B&B in Blarghour, where the pair were staying, had reported them missing at about 2130 GMT on Monday.
    £6,000 search
    A total of 20 coastguards, five police officers and a number of local volunteers took part in shoreline searches that were hampered by snow and fog.
    A spokesman for Clyde Coastguard said the search had probably cost about £6,000.
    Stuart Atkinson, watch officer for the coastguard, said the pair should have told their host at the B&B what they had been planning.
    "If you are going to do this kind of thing you should let people ashore know you're doing it," he said.
    "You don't expect people to go camping at this time of year, so our advice would be, always let somebody ashore know where you're going and when you're going to be back, otherwise this is what happens."

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    Not Me!!

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    Default lost!!

    OK! the guilty party step forward.lost on loch awe.
    sounds like a good plan............without the helecopter chaps

    alls well that ends well eh!!
    love alot, trust a few but always paddle your own canoe

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    Default Missing canoeists found on Island!

    Two canoeists whose disappearance sparked a major search of a loch have been found camping on an island. The pair, aged in their 30s, had not been seen for more than 12 hours when they were spotted at about 0215 GMT, on Loch Awe, near Oban, Argyll and Bute.
    Rescuers said the man and the woman, from Leeds, had set up camp on Innis Chonnell island for the night but had not told anyone.
    A rescue helicopter, two boats and five other vehicles were used in the search.
    The owners of a B&B in Blarghour, where the pair were staying, had reported them missing at about 2130 GMT on Monday.
    £6,000 search
    A total of 20 coastguards, five police officers and a number of local volunteers took part in shoreline searches that were hampered by snow and fog.
    A spokesman for Clyde Coastguard said the search had probably cost about £6,000.
    Stuart Atkinson, watch officer for the coastguard, said the pair should have told their host at the B&B what they had been planning.
    "If you are going to do this kind of thing you should let people ashore know you're doing it," he said.
    "You don't expect people to go camping at this time of year, so our advice would be, always let somebody ashore know where you're going and when you're going to be back, otherwise this is what happens."



    Apparently we are not expected to go camping this time of year? Must have spoken to my other half!!

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/7137747.stm
    Last edited by nigelp; 11th-December-2007 at 10:46 AM. Reason: Added text.
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    Thumbs up re missing canoeists

    Cant believe how stupid some people can be,having lived in the area for many years and knowing the loch well it beggars belief that two selfish people would do something so thick,
    many people have died on Loch Awe as well as the surrounding mountains,so when somebody is overdue it sparks a major search,costing thousands and causing lots of grief for the rescue services many of whom are volunteers.
    Please just use a bit of savvy let somebody know your plans,
    It costs nothing and could save your life
    Rain is only beer thats still to be made

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    Goes without saying it wont be anyone from this forum - I hope.
    Aslan




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    Default missing canoeists

    I don't want to judge them with so little information. It doesn't say in the article if they said they'd back at the B&B that night.
    I think the idea of bing off without telling anyone where we're going appeals to most of us at some time or another.

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    Default There usually are two sides to most stories so...

    I shall not be in a hurry to condemn this pair unless I hear a bit more.

    If they really were ‘camping’ and not just sheltering then perhaps they did fail to tell someone.

    However;

    It could easily be a mix up of communications – I have sometimes paid for a B&B in order to get the parking, storage for my civilisation clothes and somewhere to wash and brush up in after my trip.


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    Default Missing canoeists not, ermm ...missing

    Deary me - canoeists or kayakers?
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/7137747.stm
    "Off all the small nations of this earth, perhaps only the ancient Greeks surpass the Scots in their contribution to mankind." (Sir Winston Churchill)

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    Well, maybe it's just me, but whose business is it anyway? I often camp without telling anyone but my wife. She often has no idea where I am. I wonder how long it would take her to get worried.

    On the other hand - we often get calls for searches. At this time we have several people (that I can think of) who've never been found. For some reason, many people like to commit suicide in a wilderness setting. Why is that?

    I guess if you've rented a room for the night - and you don't plan to show up - it would be appropriate to leave word with your landlord.
    The perfect canoe -
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    When I was about 16 I took off to the woods for a few days and did leave word with my mother where I would be. Somewhere within five miles of the house or the back 50' wood lot. She worked at a nursing home for elderly people at the time and told one of her co-workers I am not sure where My son is I haven't seen him for days.

    One of the old ladies overheard the conversation and a group of them alerted the Mounties. The RCMP then opened a file and began the process of the search. When they questioned my mother, she wondered who had called them and she soon found out it was an Alzheimer's patient at the care home. She let them know of my approximate whereabouts and the search was cancelled in time. Well, give us a call if he doesn't show was the official response.

    Nobody would have found me anyhow unless there was a family member on the search team that knew the campsites I was likely to use.
    Lloyd

    Sometimes you're the windshield, sometimes you're the bug...


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    Quote Originally Posted by pierre girard View Post
    On the other hand - we often get calls for searches. At this time we have several people (that I can think of) who've never been found. For some reason, many people like to commit suicide in a wilderness setting. Why is that?

    I guess if you've rented a room for the night - and you don't plan to show up - it would be appropriate to leave word with your landlord.
    True and why do the travel up form the Smoke to do it - you can get neck ache looking up into trees.

    If they had paid for a B&B or where using the car park it would of been a) polite to let saomeone know b) a sensible precaution to avoid and unnecessary search.

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    Wasn't this Leodian


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    Quote Originally Posted by Thysville View Post
    I shall not be in a hurry to condemn this pair unless I hear a bit more.

    If they really were ‘camping’ and not just sheltering then perhaps they did fail to tell someone.

    However;

    It could easily be a mix up of communications – I have sometimes paid for a B&B in order to get the parking, storage for my civilisation clothes and somewhere to wash and brush up in after my trip.

    Yep I agree.

    I think the biggest problem we have is that people will come from the cities out to the country (no problem so far), but they fail to understand the problem there can be.

    Yes our country isn't that hazardous by many standards but the cold will kill you if you are not prepared properly. A fair number perish each year in the lakes because they think oh its sunny and hot at the bottom so must be the same on the tops. Fog comes in and, bye-bye! Most seem to be found dead about 4ft from a path (of course sometimes its just your time like the person who died when sheep landed on them in the langdales)!

    This then causes a lot of searches so it becomes common to worry the moment someone thinks someone might possible, perhaps, remotely be overdue for a possibly, supposed time.

    Obvious stuff really but just tell people, if they get it wrong then they get it wrong!

    Pete
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    Quote Originally Posted by pieface View Post
    I think the idea of bing off without telling anyone where we're going appeals to most of us at some time or another.
    But particularly to Canoeists apparently!? (Caledonian Canal last year, Panama Canal next year?? )
    The Canoeist's prayer: "Lord grant me the serenity to walk the portages I must, The courage to run the rapids I can, And the wisdom to know the difference".

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    Point 1.
    It seems to me they planned to camp out as they took camping gear with them..

    Point 2.

    When ever I have booked into a guesthouse I have never told the owners where I am going. even when I have walked the Hills or canoed.

    So in my opinion they have done nothing wrong.
    Love lots trust few always paddle your own canoe

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lakeland Pete View Post
    of course sometimes its just your time like the person who died when sheep landed on them in the langdales
    What! There is a story there for sure ....
    ( & oo'er missus - is the phrase - "in the langdales" a colloquialism for something?)

    I had, (indeed still do have) a mate who walked up Yr Wyddfa in the middle of summer in jeans, DM's and a t-shirt, with a handful of provisions (a 'garage' pasty, a bottle of beer, a bottle of coke and his fags) in a plastic carrier bag, and ended up being helped off the mountain as he'd overdone it.

    The mountain rescue guys said that they get more trouble in the summer than at any other time of year, simply because of the likes of him ...

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    Quote Originally Posted by monkey_pork View Post
    What! There is a story there for sure ....
    ( & oo'er missus - is the phrase - "in the langdales" a colloquialism for something?)
    When bored at work in the lakes I used to read the local obituaries - a real interesting way to find how many tourists had died and would no longer be bothering you. Well in the local paper one day this was the main story.

    It appears (and this is as reported-ish) that a sheep "jumped" off a crag that was overhanging a footpath - being a large fell breed Herdwick it weighed a fair amount and so plummeted without remorse downwards. Unfortunately there was a person on the footpath directly beneath the crag and as the laws of physics go the walker met their end (I would say maker but that just seems unlikely!).

    The paper didn't say what happened to the sheep.

    I forget the year but it was an eventful one, it was the same year as the RAF rescue heli crash in the langdales which saw two (?) helicopters crash whilst trying to rescue a stuck walker.

    Pete
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    Quote Originally Posted by monkey_pork View Post
    (a 'garage' pasty, a bottle of beer, a bottle of coke and his fags)
    Sounds like the contents of my ditch bag!


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    On a slightly different tack of telling people about plans etc to prevent unneccesary searches, apparently on the Dart there have been a number of searches for kayakers when they've lost boats and haven't told the local police station that there's a loose kayak. So if you abandon or lose a boat remember to tell the (phone the none emergency number). A couple of posts from UKRGB:



    "As I was changing at Clifford Bridge before a relatively civil paddle on the Teign today, a gentleman in an estate car asked us to look out for his blue kayak which had been lost on the upper Teign earlier. We cheerfully said we would, he went on his way home and we went off to paddle. We did not find his boat but someone else did and it is now being stored by the police; if the owner would like to pm me I will advise him where to reclaim it.

    Unfortunately it was found by a walker who alerted the authorities who then instigated a full search and rescue operation involving divers, Dartmoor Rescue Group, Fire Brigade and police. Now we can all argue that this was an over-reaction to the situation, but it is almost identical to what happened on the same river last year and I had hoped that the message had got out then. If you loose a boat PLEASE let the emergency services know. They will need to know the colour, make and model, and where you last saw it, and this simple knowledge can save a lot of time effort and risk for others.
    There have been lots of boats lost this weekend and that raises two questions; are people being wreckless and thoughtless in going on water which is beyond their capability, and have all the owners informed the police of their losses? I suspect the former question could lead to some interesting responses!

    Adam Box
    BCU Regional Access Officer"



    "Good afternoon

    I am the duty Inspector for the area covering Dartmoor where we have had exetensive white water rafting due to heavy rainfall and obviously many have endeavoured to try their luck and skill on the various rivers.

    Regretfully I have had eight seperate reports of canoes upturned in swollen rivers each requiring a response to establish health and welfare of the canoeist. I have only had one canoeist take the time or trouble to ring and say he is safe and well, the river he was on plus location, the canoe colour with full contact details.

    Those canoeists that have unfortunately parted company with tehir canoes have required extensive use of Police resources and I would appreciate the opportunity of you addressing members through the forum. Police resources include paying overtime for our Force diving team Force helicopter whilst other rescue services have refused to attend due to the nature and speed of water flow of the rivers concerned.

    In the event of similar incidents can I ask that canoeists please ensure the Police are immediately notified using - non emergency number 08452 777 444 provide exact location, river, canoe colour make and type and any significant identification features plus canoeist details and contact numbers. This would be much appreciated

    Many thanks

    Mark Taylor

    Duty Inspector
    South & West Devon Basic Command Unit"



    Non-emergency numbers at http://website.lineone.net/~familykeens/policeno.htm



    "If a boat is found with no pilot it is very likely someone has got into trouble.

    If they emergency services have no evidence that the person is alive and well then I certainly hope they would do something. There is very little chance of finding out who the owner of the boat is so what other option do they have.

    Maybe a simple start would be for ALL paddlers to put a contact number on their boat. This means a simple phone call could prevent a search.

    I recall the Liffey Decent oragnisers used to ask all competitors to put their name and number on both ends of their boat (in case it broke) so that if any were found they could check the whereabouts of it's owner."
    'Of all the paths you choose in life, make sure some of them are wet'

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    Default And mark your boat with contact details

    And, while we are at it, we should mark the boat with contact details so that a) they can send it back to you and b) contact the number and see if they need to find you as well.

    Philip

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    Quote Originally Posted by Amelia View Post
    Maybe a simple start would be for ALL paddlers to put a contact number on their boat. This means a simple phone call could prevent a search.
    If I was in the UK, I would head down to the local ex-army store or engraving shop and have some dog tags made up to be pop riveted to the deck plates. Helps with the little theft problem you have over there too.

    Typically over here people that find canoes go looking for the owners themselves and do not involve police.

    Two years ago a couple of guys lost a canoe in some whitewater in Fredericton in cold weather. The canoe was found by some locals a few hundred yards down stream and they put it in their truck and drove up river. They found the guys that lost it on the wrong side of the river who then crossed over to thank their rescuers.

    One guy had lost his trousers swimming in the rapid and both were wet and frozen half to death. To add insult to injury their car keys were in the pocket of the lost trousers.

    No word on how much perfectly good beer they lost. Most likely a contributing factor.
    Lloyd

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    Quote Originally Posted by Amelia View Post
    If they emergency services have no evidence that the person is alive and well then I certainly hope they would do something. There is very little chance of finding out who the owner of the boat is so what other option do they have.

    Maybe a simple start would be for ALL paddlers to put a contact number on their boat. This means a simple phone call could prevent a search.

    I recall the Liffey Decent oragnisers used to ask all competitors to put their name and number on both ends of their boat (in case it broke) so that if any were found they could check the whereabouts of it's owner."
    Locally (in Minnesota) every canoe is licensed. First thing we do is run the number and contact the owner. Saves a lot of leg work if the canoe simply drifted away.
    The perfect canoe -
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    Quote Originally Posted by pierre girard
    Locally (in Minnesota) every canoe is licensed. First thing we do is run the number and contact the owner.
    Could this be a useful function for the BCU? If a canoe is carrying a BCU Registration/Licence the owner could, in theory, be traced via that. The problem is that I doubt the BCU or their database could be available 24/7 - in fact weekends and bank holidays which are probably the most popular time for paddling would be exactly when they are not available

    The BCU sticker used to have our names on but this was removed (as a precaution against identity theft, terrorist threat, sexual harassment or some other crime against political correctness ) and now we are being urged to add even more detail like phone numbers and addresses.
    Keith

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    Quote Originally Posted by Crocbait View Post
    Point 1.
    It seems to me they planned to camp out as they took camping gear with them..

    Point 2.

    When ever I have booked into a guesthouse I have never told the owners where I am going. even when I have walked the Hills or canoed.

    So in my opinion they have done nothing wrong.
    common sense would seem to dissagree with that statement,if we are not carefull we may end up having to pay to be rescued,dont fancy that myself does it hurt so much to be courteous
    Rain is only beer thats still to be made

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    Perhaps it would have been wise to tell the B&B that they were not going to be returning that night. But a sense of freedom and not having to tell others of all our plans, appeals to an increasing number of folk. Swings and rounderabouts.

    Hopefully they will concider their future plans and inform where such is due. Thankfully, nobody was hurt or died.

    TGB
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    May all your winds be gentle. And for ww - May it rain the night before.

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    Default Identifying the boat.

    Quote Originally Posted by KeithD View Post
    Could this be a useful function for the BCU? If a canoe is carrying a BCU Registration/Licence the owner could, in theory, be traced via that.
    The problem with that is that I have access to three canoes plus a kayak or two and have taken to carrying my registration sticker from boat to boat in an Aquapack with my car keys.

    Having read all this though I might be considering the dog tag idea or a waterporoof felt pen.

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    I've never stayed at a B&B, I prefer to stink til I get home, but isn't it polite to let them know that you won't be wanting breakfast in the morning?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Crocbait View Post
    Point 1.
    It seems to me they planned to camp out as they took camping gear with them..

    Point 2.

    When ever I have booked into a guesthouse I have never told the owners where I am going. even when I have walked the Hills or canoed.

    So in my opinion they have done nothing wrong.
    Quote Originally Posted by deutsch duke View Post
    common sense would seem to dissagree with that statement,if we are not carefull we may end up having to pay to be rescued,dont fancy that myself does it hurt so much to be courteous
    If you have to tell everyone what you are doing, when you are going, where you are going, and when you will be back, why not just issue everyone travel papers and hold their family for safe keeping to make sure they return.



    Who's business is it if someone wants to camping anyhow? I am courteous to my mom and let her know I will be gone for a week but it never crosses my mind to tell the guy at the hotel if I stay there before setting off.

    I would like to say that any rescue costs should go to the owner of the hotel for not minding his own business; but if a half dozen people a year get killed in your area by being stupid?
    As a hotel manager, it is a tough call... Get involved or no? Unfortunately stories like this are less than rare and I guess people that go out into nature in the UK are looked at as weirdos by the indoor majority anyway so this type of thing is likely to continue.
    Lloyd

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    Quote Originally Posted by WhyAyeMan View Post
    If you have to tell everyone what you are doing, when you are going, where you are going, and when you will be back, why not just issue everyone travel papers and hold their family for safe keeping to make sure they return.



    Who's business is it if someone wants to camping anyhow? I am courteous to my mom and let her know I will be gone for a week but it never crosses my mind to tell the guy at the hotel if I stay there before setting off.

    I would like to say that any rescue costs should go to the owner of the hotel for not minding his own business; but if a half dozen people a year get killed in your area by being stupid?
    As a hotel manager, it is a tough call... Get involved or no? Unfortunately stories like this are less than rare and I guess people that go out into nature in the UK are looked at as weirdos by the indoor majority anyway so this type of thing is likely to continue.
    Does this mean we should point blame at the hotel owners for doing something that they thought may save two lives?

    Of course not, and I know thats not what your saying but I find it hard to understand any critisism of the alarm being raised here.

    If the hotel owners had done nothing and the canoeists bodies had been found a week later would we be praising the owners for respecting their privicy?

    It would seem common sence and no big deal to mention you were going camping overnight on a remote, 22 mile long loch to the owners if you were already staying there.
    Also known as Graeme!

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    Always a tough call doing what you think is right.

    In Canada serious remote trips often open a file at the nearest RCMP detachment. I don't consider Loch Awe remote because you can get ice creme mars bars at the little store across from the railway stop but everything is relative so some may consider it remote and worth filing a trip plan with someone.
    Lloyd

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    Quote Originally Posted by WhyAyeMan View Post
    Always a tough call doing what you think is right.

    In Canada serious remote trips often open a file at the nearest RCMP detachment. I don't consider Loch Awe remote because you can get ice creme mars bars at the little store across from the railway stop but everything is relative so some may consider it remote and worth filing a trip plan with someone.
    Yes I agree it might not seem too remote compared with canoeing in other parts of the world (canada for example!), everything is relative. I remember enjoying reading your blog on your loch Awe trip, as I always do.

    It is a valid observation that when you go camping in the wild you will probably not want to be disturbed, but I do think that in this particular case the sensible thing to have done would be to tell someone in the hotel you were staying in what your overnight plans were.

    Anyway the most important fact is there was not any injury/death involved, perhaps people reading about this will consider that their actions may, rightly or wrongly, involve the coastguard, who volunteer to put their own lives at risk in order to help others.
    Also known as Graeme!

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