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Thread: Photographs of Offensive River Signage Here Please

  1. #1

    Default Photographs of Offensive River Signage Here Please

    I'd like to compile a Youtube video about all the offensive signage that exists on the upper reaches of our rivers. Please can you pm me as many pics as possible of 'private property, no access' signs. Anything which you find offensive will be useful, but 'private fishing, no canoeing' ones are the best. I regard them as pure gold. Just let me know which stretches of river they occur on so I can tag them in the video. Date taken would also be useful, just so we can monitor if any them get taken down.

    Thanks

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    How about this one,


    from this thread, http://www.songofthepaddle.co.uk/for...ighlight=frome


    Jon.
    Selway Fisher Peterborough 15' - 21Kgs
    FU-BCU Level 2 (Owns a canoe and gets out there and enjoys themselves)

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    I don't see that well, and I don't read that fast at normal paddling speed.

  4. #4

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    Quote Originally Posted by ezwater View Post
    I don't see that well, and I don't read that fast at normal paddling speed.
    I do. I see it all very clearly.

    Thanks for the input guys. It's a bit sad really, but within just a few hours I've received loads of photos of offensive signage on the Dart, Kennet, Frome, Tywi and Hampshire Avon.

    I posted this one on Youtube a few minutes ago.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j2b7d_fhyo8

    It's just an initial stab that's less than 3 minutes duration, but bear in mind that it went from conception, to data gathering, to editing, to broadcast in less that 12 hours. And the pics continue to roll in all the time. The more pics I get, I'll just keep adding them and extending the length of the video. Lets try and get it up to 60 minutes of offensive signage and melancholy music! Keep it coming, great stuff.

  5. #5

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    Could you add sub-titles telling us where the signs are please, and whether they refer to a river or a lake/reservoir?
    Paul.

    Canoeing is a series of brews seperated by stretches of water...

  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by halfwit View Post
    Could you add sub-titles telling us where the signs are please, and whether they refer to a river or a lake/reservoir?
    I've amended the Youtube title to clarify that the pics refer to the rivers Kennet, Frome, Tywi and Hampshire Avon, no still waters as far as I'm aware, although I'm obviously relying on others for the source material. If I can get enough pics to extend video duration then I'll add subtitles which scroll with the film. The important thing is to just keep those pics rolling in.

  7. #7

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    This is a brilliant idea... Well done...
    Doug Dew
    "The best is yet to come" My Father


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    i have to agree with most of the sign owners...the land is private
    the water is not!!
    nature is m X-box

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    It's interesting to note that most are not confident enough to put their details on the signs.

    I have to agree with "andym" though we may not like the signs relating to private land but they are Legal, it is the signs relating to private water we should concentrate on as they are not legal (in my opinion).
    "Rules are for the obedience of fools and the guidance of wise men"
    Grp Cpt Sir Douglas Bader CBE,DSO,DFC,FRAeS.

  10. #10

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    Any sign which forbids canoeing is valid for this video, whether or not it mentions private land. We are not claiming the right to use private land... that is a red herring and a trap made by selfish land and angling interests; a trap which some people seem to be falling into. No-one can forbid canoeing on a river unless there is a specific law made by parliament for that river, which forbids it. These signs are bullying tactics that are quite unfounded in law, and it may be well be illegal to display them, on the grounds of public nuisance.
    Last edited by dougdew99; 5th-November-2012 at 12:46 PM.
    Doug Dew
    "The best is yet to come" My Father


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    Quote Originally Posted by jondavy View Post
    This sign is amusing in some kind of peculiar way.

    The top sign contains a threat (what danger requires a warning?) purporting to rely on the second for its validity.

    The second is a statement of a generally held convention.

    The third informs you that you have not actually reached the tidal limit (ie mean high water mark) which invalidates the restriction in the top one.

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    Maybe I can get some more mileage out of this...

    Lloyd

    Sometimes you're the windshield, sometimes you're the bug...


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    In at least some states in the States, no trespassing signs must include info on who posted and contact information. But at least in Georgia, that "law" is seldom observed prior to the landowner sliding a shell into the breech.

  14. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by lloyd View Post
    maybe i can get some more mileage out of this...

    hahahahahahahah!


    "I'm only saying it coz it's the truth!"

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    Sorry, I know its not what you are looking for, but even the dog walkers in our country get told off by the fishermen.

    We must have oversensitive fish round here.



    Big Al.

    Only when the last tree has died
    and the last river been poisoned
    and the last fish been caught
    will we realise we cannot eat money.
    ~Cree Indian Proverb

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    thanks for making it clearer doug, thats what i ment,
    they are using private land to imply private water!
    nature is m X-box

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    Just as an aside, has anyone been along the Llangollen canal? There are big signs saying "No Fishing!", while just below these are signs telling anglers to beware of overhead electricity lines when casting!

  18. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by Big Al. View Post
    Sorry, I know its not what you are looking for, but even the dog walkers in our country get told off by the fishermen.
    We must have oversensitive fish round here.
    It's preciselly what I want Al, evidence of unreasonable behaviour beyond the shores of England and Wales. I take it you're in Northern Ireland? Please be assured that every photograph which is posted on here or sent to me personally gets duly catalogued and squirreled away on a river by river basis. I wouldn't be surprised if I start receiving photos from the Falkland Islands next. Thanks for the input mate.
    Last edited by sobranie; 6th-November-2012 at 10:16 PM.

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    And where is this?

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    The Derwent just above Matlock.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SimonMW View Post
    Just as an aside, has anyone been along the Llangollen canal? There are big signs saying "No Fishing!", while just below these are signs telling anglers to beware of overhead electricity lines when casting!
    I'm guessing the no fishing signs are to remind people that they need a permit before fishing, and the signs for anglers are for those who already have a permit.......

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    Quote Originally Posted by Big Al. View Post
    Sorry, I know its not what you are looking for, but even the dog walkers in our country get told off by the fishermen.

    We must have oversensitive fish round here.




    Religious fish too.......

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    Quote Originally Posted by davidh View Post
    Religious fish too.......
    Get thee, with thy salmon rod, to Scotland for a weekend.

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    I'm guessing the no fishing signs are to remind people that they need a permit before fishing, and the signs for anglers are for those who already have a permit.......

    Doesn't appear that way. Seems that fishing is banned from the canal totally. There's no mention of permits.

  26. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by ezwater View Post
    In at least some states in the States, no trespassing signs must include info on who posted and contact information. But at least in Georgia, that "law" is seldom observed prior to the landowner sliding a shell into the breech.
    My personal favorite (not from Georgia - it's in Tx)






    (I should translate: "holler" = "hollow", a slight land depression, usually along lowlands close to watercourses.)

  27. #27

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    Quote Originally Posted by sk8r View Post
    My personal favorite (not from Georgia - it's in Tx)






    (I should translate: "holler" = "hollow", a slight land depression, usually along lowlands close to watercourses.)
    Brilliant, I've just sent a copy to Barak Obama to request an expanation. Which State / river catchment did this occur in please?

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    sobranie,
    As both a keen angler & canoeist... 'this old chestnut' ...cropping up once again, makes me feel like 'sliding a few shells into the breech'....(and it's been a while since I did that last!)... Though I must say, that keeping your dogs on a lead... 'to avoid disturbing the fish'... is totally absurb!
    I've got 'my own personal beef' with landowners in the Thames Valley area.... and know that I ain't gonna' beat 'em...(The're too well connected!)
    I might not win the war in my personal area, but will certainly enjoy the skirmishes!

    C'est Le Vie Mon Amie!

    Bon Chance!

    sk8tr...

    I'm gonna' have this sign modified and hung on my back garden shed!
    I love it!

    I spent 10yrs working with a diver from Texas....(ten years of my life lost underwater)....and ten years of Texan attitude....that maybe rubbed off!
    After 60 days of work (and no alcohol) I'd go home for 30 days and get drunk...he'd go home and shoot wild boar!

    But... I'll bet you now that he's out there somewhere right now... taking 'English tea' and beng 'slightly more reserved' in that great big country of yours!.....Well.... just maybe...huh!?


    MB
    Keep yer paddles wet, and powder dry....

    MB

    `..`. ><(((( ((>
    `..`..`. ><((((>

  29. #29

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    I do recall seeing a good one in India along the lines of "WARNING, THERE ARE CROCODILES IN THE RIVER, SWIMMING IS STRICTLY PROHIBED, TRESPASSERS WILL BE EATEN". I wish I'd taken a photograph of it.

    Anyway, this is about England, Wales and Northern Ireland, not America and India. This is the latest Youtube effort : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RtJWI...1&feature=plcp

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    Nice work sobranie. When I view the youtube vid though, the quality is really low. It's not a problem on the close ups, and signs with large text, but the river Dart sign is unreadable, so the relevance of the text is lost. Is it just a temporary glitch, or is it me.
    Cheers,
    Paul.
    Just goin with the flow

  31. #31

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    Quote Originally Posted by paulsmith View Post
    Nice work sobranie. When I view the youtube vid though, the quality is really low. It's not a problem on the close ups, and signs with large text, but the river Dart sign is unreadable, so the relevance of the text is lost. Is it just a temporary glitch, or is it me.
    Cheers,
    Paul.
    Thanks Paul, I find the quality of Youtube videos gradually improves over the first 48 hours of posting. I take your point though. How about getting out there again and taking another set of pics? Next broadcast, you get bumped straight to the top of queue ....

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    Good video. What gave me a good chuckle, and also extreme annoyance simultaneous was the sign at the very end on the Usk at Abergavenny! Surely even the anglers must know that below Crickhowell the Usk is a totally undisputed navigation?!

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    I know this is a little OT, but the signs that makes me chuckle every time time I paddle past are on the Scouts' water frontage next to the Bridgewater canal at Grappenhall.

    One sign reads, "Scouts - Join the Adventure."
    The next reads, "Private - Keep out."

    Graham

  34. #34

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    Quote Originally Posted by GrahamC View Post
    I know this is a little OT, but the signs that makes me chuckle every time time I paddle past are on the Scouts' water frontage next to the Bridgewater canal at Grappenhall.

    One sign reads, "Scouts - Join the Adventure."
    The next reads, "Private - Keep out."

    Graham
    Can I have a pic of it please? I think the scouts should be more vocal on this issue, and I would like to take it up with them.

  35. #35

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    Sobranie

    this just gets better and better... I wonder if you have considered adding some text at the start or at the end pointing out that these notices have no basis in law in so far as no one has then right to forbid canoeing on these rivers and it is all a giant confidence trick on the part of land owners and anglers?
    Doug Dew
    "The best is yet to come" My Father


  36. #36

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    Quote Originally Posted by dougdew99 View Post
    I wonder if you have considered adding some text at the start or at the end pointing out that these notices have no basis in law in so far as no one has then right to forbid canoeing on these rivers and it is all a giant confidence trick on the part of land owners and anglers?
    Done, I've also added a few annotations against some of the more preposterous signs.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sobranie View Post
    Done, I've also added a few annotations against some of the more preposterous signs.
    With regard to the signs in the Kennet at Denford near Hungerford, I wrote to the town clerk in 2008 about this, and was told I'd made a mistake in referring to the the sign as saying the "Trustees of the Town and Mayor of Hungerford" (and that the sign said 'Manor'). On checking back, it was, as you can see, the sign writer's error, but of course it has never been changed.

    This bit of river is protected for exclusive use by a unique medieval anachronism. Having been granted 'commoners' rights in the 14th Century, today these rights are limited to the possessors of approx. 105 properties in the town that are anything but 'common', and are jealously guarded by a rotating coterie.

    Most of the time much of the river here is too shallow to paddle, but just in case the plebs get ideas...


  38. #38

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    Quote Originally Posted by John Saunders View Post
    With regard to the signs in the Kennet at Denford near Hungerford, I wrote to the town clerk in 2008 about this, and was told I'd made a mistake in referring to the the sign as saying the "Trustees of the Town and Mayor of Hungerford" (and that the sign said 'Manor'). On checking back, it was, as you can see, the sign writer's error, but of course it has never been changed.
    Right, so he's happily sat on his arse for four years and allowed a few militant fishermen and landowners to bring his office into disrepute? I expect better from our public officials, and I think he should resign immediately.

    The picture of the razor wire strung across the river was truly shocking. I've heard rumours and threats about this sort thing, but it's the first time I've seen incontrovertable proof. Thanks for posting

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    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RtJWI...feature=relmfu

    At 1:47 the sign reads "The Royalty fishery, is both an SSSI.." If it is a SSSI you are not allowed to remove wildlife, trees etc so how can you fish?

  40. #40

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    Quote Originally Posted by kharga View Post
    At 1:47 the sign reads "The Royalty fishery, is both an SSSI.." If it is a SSSI you are not allowed to remove wildlife, trees etc so how can you fish?
    Kharga, it's ok to fish in an SSSI, just as it's ok to paddle down it. It just means that the river has been given a conservation designation. What I struggle with is how it can be permissable to repeatedly stock a species of non-native fish (barbel) into the Hampshire Avon and Broads catchments at taxpayers expense? It's you and me that are paying for the anglers to do this my friend, and if you're as outraged as me by this situation, then I'm afraid all I can suggest is that you write to your MP and complain. Vociferously. And please feel free to attach a link to my video.

    PS, Kharga, the Hampshire Avon is not only an SSSI, it has a much higher conservation designation as a Special Area of Conservation. This means it falls under the auspices of the Habitats Directive. Of course, that hasn't stopped the UK Govt stuffing it full of barbel for the commercial gain of a few landowners. I've got a complaint lodged with DEFRA and the European Commission at the moment, ref : CHAP(2011)00965. Curiously, niether body seem very enthusiastic to deal with the issues.

    PPS, Kharga. Barbel actively predate on all the species for which the Avon received it's Special Area of Conservation designation from the European Commission; lamprey, and atlantic salmon spawn to name but 2.
    Last edited by sobranie; 9th-November-2012 at 07:08 PM.

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    Re the wire across the river. To be fair, it's possible that it was innocently put there by a farmer to stop cattle straying under the bridge into another persons land. We get it sometimes on our rivers and it's definitely not there to snag anyone. It could also be there to stop paddlers, and if that is the case it is clearly wrong, but I think we need to be carefull about making accusations without good evidence. Just a thought. Still loving the vid.
    Paul.
    Just goin with the flow

  42. #42

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    Possibly could be crossed wires, but the bottom line is that cows don't pass under bridges that are less the 4ft high. If you still doubt me, ask any farmer for a professional opinion.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kharga View Post
    If it is a SSSI you are not allowed to remove wildlife, trees etc.
    Unless you are the Environment Agency. Thankfully, I believe it was the anglers that got the EA to desist from these practices on the Hants. Avon:





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    Quote Originally Posted by sobranie View Post
    Possibly could be crossed wires, but the bottom line is that cows don't pass under bridges that are less the 4ft high. If you still doubt me, ask any farmer for a professional opinion.
    A calf could.

  45. #45

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marcus2 View Post
    A calf could.
    What would a calf be doing in the middle of a river? More to the point, what was it's mother doing? More to the point, what was the farmer doing? The farmers you are engaging with are clearly not competent. Look Marcus, come to Suffolk my friend. There are nicer people here in the Waveney Valley.

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    Quote Originally Posted by paulsmith View Post
    Re the wire across the river. To be fair, it's possible that it was innocently put there by a farmer to stop cattle straying under the bridge into another persons land. We get it sometimes on our rivers and it's definitely not there to snag anyone. It could also be there to stop paddlers, and if that is the case it is clearly wrong, but I think we need to be carefull about making accusations without good evidence. Just a thought. Still loving the vid.
    Paul.
    In this instance livestock are already barred from the river from the right bank grazing area by fencing:


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    Quote Originally Posted by sobranie View Post
    The farmers you are engaging with are clearly not competent. There are nicer people here in the Waveney Valley.
    The farmers I 'engage' with have farmed here for generations,I think by now if they were'nt competent they would have gone bust.I assume that anyone not living in the Waveney valley are not nice ? Bit of a silly comment that one.A calf could get through either of the outer arches without being in the middle of the river and the farmer puts the wire across so he does'nt have to keep a constant eye on his or hers stock.

  48. #48

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    Quote Originally Posted by John Saunders View Post
    In this instance livestock are already barred from the river from the right bank grazing area by fencing:
    I'm not sure if that's necessary John. From my experience cows go down to the river of their own free will.

  49. #49

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marcus2 View Post
    The farmers I 'engage' with have farmed here for generations,I think by now if they were'nt competent they would have gone bust.I assume that anyone not living in the Waveney valley are not nice ? Bit of a silly comment that one.A calf could get through either of the outer arches without being in the middle of the river and the farmer puts the wire across so he does'nt have to keep a constant eye on his or hers stock.
    Well, many farmers have sadly gone bust Marcus. But here in the Waveney Valley we do not string multiple strands of barbed wire across the river to prevent canoe/livestock access. Here on the Waveney, you are free to paddle. Of course the fishermen get a bit miffed because it's one of the few rivers in the country where you can paddle without being abused, so it has become a bit of a honeypot site for canoeing. Are you seriously telling us that you would have strung barbed wire across that bridge for cattle control?

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    I'm not telling you that I would string barbed wire across anything,I'm not a farmer either.I merely made a comment saying that a calf could get under a 4 foot high arch whereas a fully matured cow could'nt as you rightly stated.You seem to have assumed that I'm on the side of the anti canoeing brigade for some reason ?

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    Putting barbed wire across a river is clearly not safe from canoeists point of view. But the farmer who put it there may not realise canoes and other craft are allowed to use the river, and may have put it there to control there livestock.
    I think it is only fair that before making any accusations some one should explain the situation to the farmer and ask them to remove the wire. There are other ways the livestock could be controlled.

    The same point may apply to some of the signs, people may genuinely believe they have full control of the river that flows through their land, and simply explaining the legal position to them politly may encourage them to remove or modify their signs. Obviously this won't work all the time, but it is a mistake to believe all land owners and anglers are against us, some just don't understand the situation, or have been misinformed.

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    Nicely put Barney

  53. #53

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    Fine, someone should talk to the farmer and ask him to remove the barbed wire. As far as I'm concerned, the farmer should not have put it there in the first place. He appears to have been misinformed, or he just doesn't understand the situation.

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    Here's one from today on the Wey. It is at the bottom of the natural river loop down from Old Woking, approx GR TQ 033 571, which has been historically used for centuries since well before the 17thC Navigation and has at least 20 boats moored at the top end at the bottom of gardens. To be fair I have never met an unfriendly fisherman or landowner here.



    Turns out Burhill Estate Co Ltd is owned by members of the Guinness family.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sobranie View Post
    Fine, someone should talk to the farmer and ask him to remove the barbed wire. As far as I'm concerned, the farmer should not have put it there in the first place. He appears to have been misinformed, or he just doesn't understand the situation.
    There is a bridge on the river Lagan, about 12 miles from Belfast and the farmer has done this....



    Now this part of the river probably has canoeists on it once or twice a year.
    The farmer has livestock in the adjacent fields all year round. This is his solution to stopping the cattle wandering off downstream. I'm more than happy to portage this obstacle. But then we don't have the same issues with access that you guys have.

    So how about a compromise? If the farmer was to put a sign further upstream warning of the hazard, then canoeists would have advanced warning and be able to avoid it.
    Big Al.

    Only when the last tree has died
    and the last river been poisoned
    and the last fish been caught
    will we realise we cannot eat money.
    ~Cree Indian Proverb

  56. #56

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    That would seem sensible, but the bottom line is that the visible timber obstacles placed under the bridge in Northern Ireland are a little different to the barbed / razor wire which has been strung across the river on the Kennet.

    The first picture is of an obstruction designed to prevent cattle fromg gaining egress to the next catchment. The second picture is of barbed / razor wire strung across the the river for the sole purpose of discouraging navigation by human beings. It's got nothing to do with cattle. IMHO

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    I suspect this stretch of the Wey is tidal, so I doubt if there is a case to answer. Please let me know if I'm wrong.

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    [QUOTE=sobranie:...."I wouldn't be surprised if I start receiving photos from the Falkland Islands next".[/QUOTE]

    Unsurprisingly then,....here's a few pics of the signs that you may encounter... should you decide upon a paddle down that way!


    One night I saw the biggest ever Sea-Trout jump in this river..(a huge silver bar)...and would of loved to have stopped for a while and fished for it .....but, unfortunately.... I was otherwise being engaged!

    I don't think any of this river actually runs through any private property?...If it does... then me an a whole battalion of old Paratroopers are now very much guilty of 'trespass en mass!' (We used this river for navigational purposes).

    "Get 'orf my land!"

    These days, the riverbank displays some of the best ever 'KEEP OUT!' signs that I've seen for a while!

    Apart from...maybe this one!


    Best regards,

    MB
    Last edited by Bonarmbj; 10th-November-2012 at 02:50 AM.

  59. #59

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    Blimy, a whole battalion of paratroopers. That must have been messy. And some plucky landowner told them to 'get orf my land'. Brave man. This is a rendition of the Black Bear, played by the ony regiment that can do it properly, the Black Watch : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-ThnH...&feature=share

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    Quote Originally Posted by sobranie View Post
    Kharga, it's ok to fish in an SSSI, just as it's ok to paddle down it. It just means that the river has been given a conservation designation. What I struggle with is how it can be permissable to repeatedly stock a species of non-native fish (barbel) into the Hampshire Avon and Broads catchments at taxpayers expense? It's you and me that are paying for some anglers to do this my friend,


    PPS, Kharga. Barbel actively predate on all the species for which the Avon received it's Special Area of Conservation designation from the European Commission; lamprey, and atlantic salmon spawn to name but 2.
    Not all anglers agree with barbel being stocked. They re not native to the Wye (if fairness, I'm not either, but I don't predate on salmon or lamprey eggs) and most of us would be happier without them over here where they were stocked illegally on the 60's.

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