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Thread: canoe sail kit

  1. #1
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    Default canoe sail kit

    Hi, I have at last had a play with my new Wayland folding Kayak, and a closer look at the sailing kit that came with it. I always thought it would also adapt to being used with my Oldtown canoe. So the weather being fine I opened it out on my drive and was very impressed with the full kit that only cost 150, I dont think anybody could put this piece of gear together for the money. all fittings are S/Steel, I will certainly be using it on my canoe as well, with a few adaptions, ie. A mast mount, as the one with the kit fits into its own attachment on the Kayak . I have put some pics up for anybody that might be interested in a sail kit for a canoe,which after having a closer look could be made to fit most canoes. Also A picture showing it fitted to the folding kayakany. questions?feel free. be safe. bigH.














    Last edited by MagiKelly; 26th-June-2009 at 11:01 AM. Reason: edit pics from thumbnails

  2. #2
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    Default

    Very nice.

    I have experimented with a bit of bamboo and an old sheet, which works fine for downwind drifting but for my new canoe i thought i might try and build something a bit better (next season)

    Have you tried any windward tacking yet?
    The lee board looks so tiny on these canoe designs, but i guess not much narrower than a Topper dinghy.

  3. #3
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    Default sail kit

    Hi STU9000, Sorry, I have not even had it fitted onto my Kayak yet, like I said first time out of the box, so have no idea about sailing at all, not a jot,so have some new skills to learn. I will, when used on canoe, or Kayak post some pictures up for members to view. The leeboards are about 24 inches long at a guese my drive is 8 foot wide so might give a better idea of scale. watch this space. be safe. bigH.

  4. #4
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    Default canoe sail kit

    Hi stu9000, I have not had the kit fitted to anything as yet,like I said,first time out of the box and I could not wait to share it with SOTP members. I have no idea about sailing.so some new skills to aquire. the lee boards look small but are about 2 foot long,my drive is 8 foot wide so might give a better idea of scale. whether both lee boards are in the water at the same time or not? I have no idea. no doubt a wiser member might enlighten me/us. I thought it was a very impresive kit for the money. be safe.bigH.

  5. #5
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    Default sailkit update

    [thought you guys might like to know this kit has now been reduced to 125 on their web site.be safe, bigH













    [/QUOTE]

  6. #6
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    Default Fixing to hull

    Hi BigH,
    Thanks for posting these pictures. I have an Apache 16' and a 1962 Klepper T-9 folding kayak. I've been wondering about sailing one or both and would be interested --if you have time-- if you could post photos of how the mast is attached to the Wayland and/or open canoe. That would help me work out how easily it might be adapted to my own craft.

    Thanks very much.
    Ian

  7. #7
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    Default canoe sails

    Hi Ian, At the moment I only have the pics I included in the thread, when I next have the Wayland setup I will do some more closeups of the sail setup, for now, a bit I could reach easily in my garage is this,the mast mount for the Wayland, it fits on the front end of the spryskirt,yours on the Klepper is the alloy casting with the hole in it,the mast pole just sits in this. the bottom of the mast just sits on the floor boards. my son has just bought a secondhand Klepper,and the floor bit is in his, so I assume they all must be prep'd for a mast,hence the front spryskirt casing.as you can see fron the pictures,it is a pritty comprehensive kit, and I will be adapting mine to fit onto my open canoe as well. Its just a bit of woodwork as I can see. any more question I can help with.fire away.be safe.bigH.




  8. #8
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    Default Thanks

    Thanks for that. My Klepper T-9 hasn't anything similar, nor a mounting point on the floor, though as the floor is wooden it would be easy to add some sort of a mounting point there. The T-9 coaming lacking the above piece may suggest it was never meant to be sailed, unlike presumably the Aerius (I'm guessing that is what your son has). Still, very interesting to see how these things are meant to attach. And maybe it would be possible to put together something similar to slip over the coaming on my hull.

    I'll be interested to see how you go about attaching the sailkit to your open canoe when you eventually tackle that. It looks like a nice piece of kit for a very reasonable price.

    Keep us posted with your experiences of the Wayland too. Are you a member of the folding kayak forum? http://foldingkayaks.org/phpBB/
    I guess that might be a more suitable place to document your experience than this forum.

    All the best,
    Ian

  9. #9

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    That's a beautiful setup!! something to dream towards...

  10. #10
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    Hi there

    I see you have a Wayland kayak. I am thinking of buying one but am unsure how big it will be, do you think I could take two people and a collie sized dog in the cockpit Is there much stowage space onboard? I know there is a 'Trojak' model with a third seat but dont like the loss of stowage space...
    Have you got round to using the sail kit yet?

    Thanks in advance.

  11. #11
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    I have the same setup in my pouch folding kayak. It sails down wind fine, upwind the rig is virtually useless, and I find it much quicker ( if you are in a rush ??) to paddle from A > B without visiting zig or zag a million times on the way.
    Wilf
    Bacon sarnie anyone ?

  12. #12
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    Default wayland size?

    Hi Budvar, My Wayland folder is old money 17ft3inchs in length, there is a small-ish storage pocket behind the rear seat,this is what can be converted to a child seat with the seat kit available, or room for a pooch.storage is, I think, prity good as the shape of the frames of the kayak allow quite a bit of gear space/storage under the canvas. As I have been off the water for a while due to new knee operations, I will put the sails on the Wayland and take some pics, and mabe a mockup on my Oldtown 140, which I think would not be to difficult to fix the sail kit to, a crossmember for the mast mount being the major consideration. so I am now stirring from winter and operation blues and looking forward to playing with my toys again. watch this space.Be safe.bigH.

  13. #13
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    Default wayland size?

    Hi Budvar, some pics of what I have of the inside, well a bit anyway.be safe.bigH.
    Last edited by bigH; 26th-March-2010 at 12:57 PM.

  14. #14
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    Hi BigH

    Thank you very much for taking the time to post the pictures.

    Looking at your pictures, it looks like there might be enough room in front of the front paddler for our dog. Do you think this is possible? I want to use the front and rear as storage for camping equipment you see.

    Thanks again and good luck with the knees!

  15. #15
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    Default

    Hi,
    A belated thanks for the pictures, BigH. Hope your knee operation went well and that you've had a good summer playing with your handsome kayak. Did you ever get the sails up on it, or try them out on your Old Town? I've been thinking more and more about fitting a sail to my Apache canoe and this seems to be the cheapest sail one can buy by far, so it would be interesting to know, a) whether it is much good as a rig (whether you're enjoying sailing it for example) and b) how easy/difficult you found it to set it up on your Old Town. I imagine the challenges would be much the same ones I would face trying to set it up on my Apache (or Klepper).

    Wilf, interesting to hear your experience too, with something similar on a Pouch. So do you sail it much downwind, or does it all end up being too much hassle and easier just to paddle? I confess I am captivated by the idea of sailing, but do wonder whether the additional kit necessary would simply make it more complicated to get out on the water. In which case, if I'm likely to find I don't use it as much as I imagine in my head, perhaps I'd be as well saving my (very limited) money and just enjoying my paddling.

    But who hasn't been paddling on a windy day and thought about turning it to one's advantage!

    All the best,
    Ian
    PS Wayland's autumn sale is on again, but their prices have certainly increased significantly--or is it just the worthless pound?
    PPS Wayland also sell an interesting looking downwind sail without the leeboards for about 2/3 of the price.

  16. #16
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    Default And another thing ...

    One more question. I like the look of your wooden paddles. The set that came with my Klepper had a split blade, so I've been paddling it with a very cheap aluminium and plastic set. They do the job just fine, but I do like the look of wood and the Wayland ones seem reasonably priced, so it would be tempting to buy a set if I'm buying something from Wayland anyway. Do you find them a good paddle? Any problems or disadvantages to wood?

    Anyway, thanks again for any thoughts you have on the subject.
    All the best,
    Ian

    (And Budvar, did you ever buy a kayak from Wayland?)

  17. #17
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    Default wooden paddles?

    Hi idc, your question about wooden paddles would, to some of the SOTP members seem a blasphemy,Like you, I have a cheap double alloy tube paddle with plastic blades, I first bought for my Oldtown canoe, but when I bought the Wayland folding Kayak it came with 2 splitters paddles, assembled they are 1" short of 8 feet long, so I use them in both my craft, I do have 2 single wooden paddles also, but due to my arthritis it is not comfortable to Paddle on one side,or the other. for any length of time, so double paddles for me,mind you I do dip the singles occasionally. be safe.bigH. .

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigH View Post
    Hi idc, your question about wooden paddles would, to some of the SOTP members seem a blasphemy ...
    Yes! I never thought of that!
    I'm so used to associating open canoeing with traditional wooden paddles that it didn't occur to me; but with my mind on the kayak I'm aware that many seem to laud expensive high-tech materials for their double-bladed paddles. I've always liked the look of the old-school paddles, so I just wondered how you found them. They look nice!

    At the back of my mind I was wondering whether to order a pair, if I ever get round to buying stuff from Wayland.

    So back to the first of my recent questions: have you used the Wayland sail kit yet? How did you find it?

    Happy paddling.
    Ian

  19. #19
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    Default paddles

    Hi idc, I don't think you could go wrong getting a pair of paddles from Wayland, I think the prices for their gear would be hard to beat. I am looking at their comfy seats for the Kayak they look much more comfortable than the seats that came with the craft. No I haven't yet had the sail kit up on the Kayak . The last time I had it out at Ulswater I forgot to take the sail gear with me, (I blame this old mans memory) just as well, because it was a quite windy, a bit more than I would have been happy learning to sail in. I will have to get my finger out as I have been in touch with a firm who can make me a spray cover from ripstop material for my Oldtown 140 Osprey. I think my idea for fitting it might be of interest to the SOTP members so I will be putting some pics of it up. I am looking at a small simple raised frame/hood to hold it up for water clearance.(maybe plastic water pipe) I don't like the sight of waves splashing into my canoe on windy waters. be safe.bigH.
    Last edited by bigH; 19th-October-2010 at 02:35 PM. Reason: spelling

  20. #20
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    That is a very nice looking sailing rig. My only suggestioin though is to get rid of the metal clip holding the sheets to the clew of the jib. When not drawing the clew will thrash about with surprising force. At the least it will damage the mast. At worst it could have someones eye out. Mike.

  21. #21
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    Hi,
    Thought it might be worth bringing this thread to the fore again, both because we now have a sailing section in the forum and therefore more sailing eyes on it, and because there is now a wayland dealer in the UK: http://www.waylandkayaks.co.uk/

    BigH, I don't know if you have ever thought about joining the open canoe sailing group, http://www.ocsg.org.uk/ They have lots of members up north, especially the Lakes. I finally bought a canoe sail from Solway Dory, their big Expedition rig, and found them very helpful. They are enthusiasts and would surely help you get started sailing if you haven't already.

    And if you have, I'd interested to hear how the Wayland rig worked for you. Now that I'm slowly getting the hang of sailing my open canoe, I'm thinking about how best to get a sail onto my Klepper T9 kayak at a price I can afford. I probably need to fabricate or purchase parts like the ones you photographed.

    All the best,
    Ian

  22. #22
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    Default sail kit

    Hi Ian, Thanks for the update, As yet I have not had time to try sailing anything,Canoe or Kayak,busy doing other projects, but, in 4 weeks time I will be off to Norway in my Land Rover camper for 6 weeks,along with my son and family in his L/R camper, we are driving all the way there from the channel port so we should encounter plenty of O2, both of us have a folding Kayak,his being a Klepper, sadly I will not have room for my sail kit,a pitty, I am only thankfull I have room for my 2 craft, and all the gear that goes with it. Wieght being a major factor, so watch this space for some pics,coming soon.To all, be safe.BigH


  23. #23
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    I don't think they still sell this sail kit. I had a look on their website last night and the link doesn't work!

  24. #24
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    Default sail kit

    Hi Steamerpoint, You could talk to them (the UK dealer) about availability by clicking onto their contact us which has their tel number .be safe, bigH


  25. #25
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    Hi, I'm not in the market for one as I already have the same sailing rig as Ian. I just wanted to know more about it, in particular the twin leeboard arrangment. I just noticed that the link to the sailing rigs no longer works and made the assumption that they no longer produce them, especially as this thread is a couple of years old already.

    It sounds as if they were struggling to sell them, hence the price reduction to 125 and wonder if they gave up on them. Not a bad price when you consider that the leeboards are included also, but it appears that the sail has no shape to it and is just a flat sheet. I therefore have to assume that this is a cheap and cheerful rig that offers some form of sailing capability, but little in the way of performance, but without actually seeing one, I can't say for certain.

  26. #26
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    Hi Chris,
    I think it's the other way round, actually. The UK dealer is very new and hasn't finished populating his website yet. (It only opened in the last few days after showing a placeholder photo for about a month.) I expect there'll be more detail there soon, but in the meantime you can see the details on their polish website, which has a (mediocre) English language translation: http://www.wayland.com.pl/en/

    I notice there are also a number of links there that don't work too, but you can download their catalogue and price list. Wayland's prices have almost doubled in the past few years. I'm not sure how much that is a sign of the fall of the pound against the zloty, but I notice their euro prices have also gone up by a lot. I think they may have just decided to start charging closer to the prices that their German competitors charge. Whether that is a sign of confidence in their quality and ability to sell, or simply a reflection of inflation in Poland, I don't know. But I'm hoping that with a new English dealer it might be possible to go and have a look at their products sometime. They're in Reading, I think.

    Compared to the prices their western competitors were charging they were unbelievably cheap, so perhaps it was inevitable that once they'd established themselves they'd start raising their prices.

    I like the sound of the holiday in Norway, BigH. I find it staggering and a real shame that there are no longer direct ferry links from the UK to places like Norway and Germany. It's not easy to get a car or a (non-folding) canoe on a plane, yet the low price airlines seem to have put all the ferry routes out of business apart from France, Holland and Denmark! Still, enjoy the long drive round. I expect it will be an adventure.

    All the best,
    Ian
    Last edited by idc; 2nd-June-2011 at 02:55 PM.

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by idc View Post
    Compared to the prices their western competitors were charging they were unbelievably cheap, so perhaps it was inevitable that once they'd established themselves they'd start raising their prices.
    (And at the old prices, I think the spars and leeboards alone might have been worth having, even if the sail turned out not to be as efficient as something like the SD sail, as one could adapt and improve.)

    There is a good set of photos of the Klepper rig here, which is what I suspect Wayland consider themselves to be imitating with their 'Latin rig':
    http://foldingkayaks.org/gallery2/ma...g2_itemId=2956

    At the other end of the price spectrum to Wayland, I found this site:
    http://www.careen.nl/#/EN/Home
    Their products look quite interesting (for kayaks, I hope the open boaters will forgive me for a moment), but the prices they are charging just seem ridiculous to me. Well, I guess I'm not their market ...

    Anyway, I need to get back to work now.
    All the best,
    Ian

  28. #28
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    This guy in the States made his own 29 sqr ft sailing rig for very little money and it goes pretty good too!


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